This episode suggests layers of depth to the Christian Nativity story and the insights it has for our own individual spiritual paths. It features meditation teacher and yogi Phil McLemore in conversation with Mormon Matters host Dan Wotherspoon about how many of the elements in the birth of Christ narrative can serve as models and teachers for our own birthing of Christ within us, our learning how to nurture and allow the development of the divinity that is our core (but is most often forgotten).
When we begin to understand that certain events portrayed in scripture are not historical, we often choose to dismiss them. This isn’t a good move, because in so doing we are throwing away chances to deepen our understanding of God and the journey we are being called to take, saying no to chances to gain insights about our true selves that can bring us great peace and reveal deep, deep significance to our lives. In short, as this conversation suggests, God is actually delighted when the literal understanding of the story no longer “does it” for us. Coming to this crossroad suggests that we are ready to go deeper, to begin to see more like mystics do, to have these stories become even more profoundly meaningful to us.
Listen in for new insights about how the things that happened in Mary are models for all of us, and how we must learn to identify with her. You’ll learn more about intercourse with God that still preserves virginity (again, we aren’t talking literal/physical things here). Why was it wonderful that there was “no room at the inn” and Jesus was instead born in a cave? Can we learn how to not just read the story, but instead become the story? It is a story that depicts the universal path to a full realization of our divine nature as human beings, just set within the particularity of Christianity. It’s quite exciting! Start listening now!
This is an encore presentation of a December 2011 Mormon Matters podcast episode examining the Christmas story as it traditionally gets told—looking closely at what the scriptures actually say and do not say about the birth of Jesus and all the pieces of this familiar story. For instance, how do the Matthew and Luke accounts differ—even irreconcilably? What are possible motives behind the Gospel writers’ decisions to shape the stories the way they did? What about Jesus’s place of birth and the reason the family was in Bethlehem (if they were)? Was there a great tax and registration? What about “no room at the inn,” the manger, the star, the magi, the story of Herod killing all male infants under two years old? How did Christmas come to be held on December 25th?
In this episode, Mormon Matters host Dan Wotherspoon and panelists Kristine Haglund, Jared Anderson, and Zina Petersen explore all these questions plus lead a fascinating tour into other parts of the Christmas story. Why are only five women mentioned in the Gospels’ presentations of Jesus’s lineage—and why are the ones listed all women with “questionable” sexual pasts? What are the Twelve Days of Christmas? What is the “Immaculate Conception” and how does it affect theology about Mary and ideas about the Eucharist and other religious devotions? How has pagan history and ideas folded into the history of “Christmas” (not Jesus’s birth but the celebration of it)? The panel discusses solstices and equinoxes, the meshing of calendaring systems, the link between carnivals and holy days, shepherds’ presents to the Christ child, and even a longstanding tradition of “ghost story” tie-ins with Christmas that Charles Dickens resurrected. Why was there a period of time in which Christmas was illegal?
The panelists also talk about Christmas music and other aesthetic elements that make this season so compelling for many people. Part of that discussion answers how and why the host and panelists and many other Christians throughout history, knowing all that they know about what likely is and is not factual about traditional accounts, still celebrate Christmas and zestfully sing carols alongside those for whom the stories are less complicated. How can those who understand that we are during this time dealing primarily in mythos rather than history (not only with the Christian story but also something like Santa Claus) still experience this season as spiritually enriching?
This is a two-part episode to be savored again!
This is an encore presentation of a December 2011 Mormon Matters podcast episode examining the Christmas story as it traditionally gets told—looking closely at what the scriptures actually say and do not say about the birth of Jesus and all the pieces of this familiar story. For instance, how do the Matthew and Luke accounts differ—even irreconcilably? What are possible motives behind the Gospel writers’ decisions to shape the stories the way they did? What about Jesus’s place of birth and the reason the family was in Bethlehem (if they were)? Was there a great tax and registration? What about “no room at the inn,” the manger, the star, the magi, the story of Herod killing all male infants under two years old? How did Christmas come to be held on December 25th?
In this episode, Mormon Matters host Dan Wotherspoon and panelists Kristine Haglund, Jared Anderson, and Zina Petersen explore all these questions plus lead a fascinating tour into other parts of the Christmas story. Why are only five women mentioned in the Gospels’ presentations of Jesus’s lineage—and why are the ones listed all women with “questionable” sexual pasts? What are the Twelve Days of Christmas? What is the “Immaculate Conception” and how does it affect theology about Mary and ideas about the Eucharist and other religious devotions? How has pagan history and ideas folded into the history of “Christmas” (not Jesus’s birth but the celebration of it)? The panel discusses solstices and equinoxes, the meshing of calendaring systems, the link between carnivals and holy days, shepherds’ presents to the Christ child, and even a longstanding tradition of “ghost story” tie-ins with Christmas that Charles Dickens resurrected. Why was there a period of time in which Christmas was illegal?
The panelists also talk about Christmas music and other aesthetic elements that make this season so compelling for many people. Part of that discussion answers how and why the host and panelists and many other Christians throughout history, knowing all that they know about what likely is and is not factual about traditional accounts, still celebrate Christmas and zestfully sing carols alongside those for whom the stories are less complicated. How can those who understand that we are during this time dealing primarily in mythos rather than history (not only with the Christian story but also something like Santa Claus) still experience this season as spiritually enriching?
This is a two-part episode to be savored again!
In this episode, Mormon Matters host Dan Wotherspoon shares his experiences with the Christmas Nativity stories as presented in the New Testament, moving from literal belief through many years of confusion, to an eventual re-embrace of them even if parts (or all) of what is depicted therein are not historical. He traces the role of Christmas hymns about the Nativity (and NOT the "seasonal carols") in helping him feel again the call of Spirit after years of deliberately ignoring it, his coming in graduate school and after many years of wrestle to understand the scriptures and these stories in new ways that have allowed (even encouraged) him to once more enjoy all the gifts awaiting in the spiritual elements of Christmas embedded in the New Testament tales.
Please enjoy this episode, and also be sure to download and listen to the encore presentations of the two-part Christmas Primer episode also released on the same day. May your Christmas season be full of joy, laughter, love, and peace!
This episode, "Table Manners" is a short reflection by Mormon Matters host Dan Wotherspoon about ways we might interact with others this holiday season. "What manner of persons should we be? Even as They are" (3 Nephi 27:27, pronouns universalized).
Happy Thanksgiving! Merry Christmas! May all your holidays (holy-days) be wonderful and bright!
The Enneagram is a powerful tool for coming to know ourselves and others. Emerging in the mid-twentieth century and refined during the ensuing years, interest in it as a tool for aiding in one's spiritual growth, understanding ourselves and others, helping to build workplace and other kinds of teams that work well together, and shedding light on the dynamics between spouses, partners, family members, and friends has steadily—and for good reasons!—increased.
In this four-part podcast episode, panelists Jana Riess and Jana Spangler, and Mormon Matters host Dan Wotherspoon share about the Enneagram itself and their experiences with it, but focus most of their attention (beginning in Part 2) on its specific applications to Mormonism, especially the ease or struggles to "fit in" or be rewarded/recognized/valued that typically arise as various personality types and the spiritual development of its members meet up with the church's truth claims, practices, institutional aspects, and Mormon culture.
In Part 4, the attention shifts to understanding the particularities of the types of spiritual work that would support each personality type as they journey toward wholenss. Each of us have a "shadow" that, beginning in childhood, was constructed to help us cope with a world that wasn't ideal in every way. Throughout our lives, and generally only when we are "forced" to confront the pain and subtle or very toxic messages we underwent and/or intuited, do we begin to notice and begin to confront these hidden aspects of ourselves. In this process, either undertaken by oneself or through partnership with a trusted therapist of spiritual director, we get in touch with these things that are keeping us back, that cause us to repeat certain patterns over and over even though we know they aren't serving us well, and, most of all, that hide ourselves from ourselves—our perfect, whole, and beloved and loving soul. It is through this "soul/shadow work" that we heal and see and feel, so much more than ever before, the joy and peace that is our birthright.
We wouldn't put out a four-hour podcast if it weren't as fascinating and terrific a conversation that the panelists and Dan had, nor if we didn't feel the Enneagram were a wonderful tool and set of lenses through which we can better understand ourselves, our church leaders, our congregants (if leaders will listen in here), and, especially, the faith challenges (many specific to aspects of Mormonism) we and others face. Please listen in! As you get started, the prospect of a four-hour listen (over several segments of time, of course!) won't seem nearly so daunting!
The Enneagram is a powerful tool for coming to know ourselves and others. Emerging in the mid-twentieth century and refined during the ensuing years, interest in it as a tool for aiding in one's spiritual growth, understanding ourselves and others, helping to build workplace and other kinds of teams that work well together, and shedding light on the dynamics between spouses, partners, family members, and friends has steadily—and for good reasons!—increased.
In this four-part podcast episode, panelists Jana Riess and Jana Spangler, and Mormon Matters host Dan Wotherspoon share about the Enneagram itself and their experiences with it, but focus most of their attention (beginning in Part 2) on its specific applications to Mormonism, especially the ease or struggles to "fit in" or be rewarded/recognized/valued that typically arise as various personality types and the spiritual development of its members meet up with the church's truth claims, practices, institutional aspects, and Mormon culture.
In Part 4, the attention shifts to understanding the particularities of the types of spiritual work that would support each personality type as they journey toward wholenss. Each of us have a "shadow" that, beginning in childhood, was constructed to help us cope with a world that wasn't ideal in every way. Throughout our lives, and generally only when we are "forced" to confront the pain and subtle or very toxic messages we underwent and/or intuited, do we begin to notice and begin to confront these hidden aspects of ourselves. In this process, either undertaken by oneself or through partnership with a trusted therapist of spiritual director, we get in touch with these things that are keeping us back, that cause us to repeat certain patterns over and over even though we know they aren't serving us well, and, most of all, that hide ourselves from ourselves—our perfect, whole, and beloved and loving soul. It is through this "soul/shadow work" that we heal and see and feel, so much more than ever before, the joy and peace that is our birthright.
We wouldn't put out a four-hour podcast if it weren't as fascinating and terrific a conversation that the panelists and Dan had, nor if we didn't feel the Enneagram were a wonderful tool and set of lenses through which we can better understand ourselves, our church leaders, our congregants (if leaders will listen in here), and, especially, the faith challenges (many specific to aspects of Mormonism) we and others face. Please listen in! As you get started, the prospect of a four-hour listen (over several segments of time, of course!) won't seem nearly so daunting!
The Enneagram is a powerful tool for coming to know ourselves and others. Emerging in the mid-twentieth century and refined during the ensuing years, interest in it as a tool for aiding in one's spiritual growth, understanding ourselves and others, helping to build workplace and other kinds of teams that work well together, and shedding light on the dynamics between spouses, partners, family members, and friends has steadily—and for good reasons!—increased.
In this four-part podcast episode, panelists Jana Riess and Jana Spangler, and Mormon Matters host Dan Wotherspoon share about the Enneagram itself and their experiences with it, but focus most of their attention (beginning in Part 2) on its specific applications to Mormonism, especially the ease or struggles to "fit in" or be rewarded/recognized/valued that typically arise as various personality types and the spiritual development of its members meet up with the church's truth claims, practices, institutional aspects, and Mormon culture.
In Part 4, the attention shifts to understanding the particularities of the types of spiritual work that would support each personality type as they journey toward wholenss. Each of us have a "shadow" that, beginning in childhood, was constructed to help us cope with a world that wasn't ideal in every way. Throughout our lives, and generally only when we are "forced" to confront the pain and subtle or very toxic messages we underwent and/or intuited, do we begin to notice and begin to confront these hidden aspects of ourselves. In this process, either undertaken by oneself or through partnership with a trusted therapist of spiritual director, we get in touch with these things that are keeping us back, that cause us to repeat certain patterns over and over even though we know they aren't serving us well, and, most of all, that hide ourselves from ourselves—our perfect, whole, and beloved and loving soul. It is through this "soul/shadow work" that we heal and see and feel, so much more than ever before, the joy and peace that is our birthright.
We wouldn't put out a four-hour podcast if it weren't as fascinating and terrific a conversation that the panelists and Dan had, nor if we didn't feel the Enneagram were a wonderful tool and set of lenses through which we can better understand ourselves, our church leaders, our congregants (if leaders will listen in here), and, especially, the faith challenges (many specific to aspects of Mormonism) we and others face. Please listen in! As you get started, the prospect of a four-hour listen (over several segments of time, of course!) won't seem nearly so daunting!
The Enneagram is a powerful tool for coming to know ourselves and others. Emerging in the mid-twentieth century and refined during the ensuing years, interest in it as a tool for aiding in one's spiritual growth, understanding ourselves and others, helping to build workplace and other kinds of teams that work well together, and shedding light on the dynamics between spouses, partners, family members, and friends has steadily—and for good reasons!—increased.
In this four-part podcast episode, panelists Jana Riess and Jana Spangler, and Mormon Matters host Dan Wotherspoon share about the Enneagram itself and their experiences with it, but focus most of their attention (beginning in Part 2) on its specific applications to Mormonism, especially the ease or struggles to "fit in" or be rewarded/recognized/valued that typically arise as various personality types and the spiritual development of its members meet up with the church's truth claims, practices, institutional aspects, and Mormon culture.
In Part 4, the attention shifts to understanding the particularities of the types of spiritual work that would support each personality type as they journey toward wholenss. Each of us have a "shadow" that, beginning in childhood, was constructed to help us cope with a world that wasn't ideal in every way. Throughout our lives, and generally only when we are "forced" to confront the pain and subtle or very toxic messages we underwent and/or intuited, do we begin to notice and begin to confront these hidden aspects of ourselves. In this process, either undertaken by oneself or through partnership with a trusted therapist of spiritual director, we get in touch with these things that are keeping us back, that cause us to repeat certain patterns over and over even though we know they aren't serving us well, and, most of all, that hide ourselves from ourselves—our perfect, whole, and beloved and loving soul. It is through this "soul/shadow work" that we heal and see and feel, so much more than ever before, the joy and peace that is our birthright.
We wouldn't put out a four-hour podcast if it weren't as fascinating and terrific a conversation that the panelists and Dan had, nor if we didn't feel the Enneagram were a wonderful tool and set of lenses through which we can better understand ourselves, our church leaders, our congregants (if leaders will listen in here), and, especially, the faith challenges (many specific to aspects of Mormonism) we and others face. Please listen in! As you get started, the prospect of a four-hour listen (over several segments of time, of course!) won't seem nearly so daunting!
This is an encore presentation of an important and still very relevant two-part episode first released on 24 April 2017.
Covenanting is a huge feature of Mormon theology and group life. Beginning at age eight with baptism, and extending through the LDS temple endowment and sealing rites, Latter-day Saints are encouraged to make many covenants with God. Sunday services build into the sacrament ritual the chance to “renew” all the covenants one has made. For many Mormons, making and renewing these covenants are among the most sacred events of their lives, inspiring them to try to live up to the ideals for living and learning, and the promises, of each covenant. For other Latter-day Saints, especially those whose faith has shifted in the years following the moments they made covenants, the burden of having covenanted to do something that they are no longer as certain about, or perhaps even now reject, can be crushing. Some feel regret that the “Mormon track” has members make covenants at very young ages, prior to entering typical developmental stages when complexity enters one’s worldview: “If only I’d known what I know now, I would have chosen differently.” Others feel they were under-prepared for the specific covenants they made in the temple, and how when they reached that stage of the endowment they went ahead with making them partly because of family and loved ones who were present and expecting that of them. Mormonism teaches that when things are done through proper priesthood authority, “what is bound on earth is bound in heaven.” How, then, should someone whose journey is taking them into great complexity regarding Mormonism relate to such weighty covenants?
In this episode, Charles Randall Paul, Jennifer Finlayson-Fife, and Joseph Stanford, join Mormon Matters host Dan Wotherspoon for a wonderful and intense query into covenanting within Mormonism and whether or not the nature of covenants, or God, has an expectation of personal growth and change that would naturally affect our views and understandings of promises we have made previously. They also discuss what exactly are we “bound” to with regard to our covenants, and several other important aspects of this topic. The panel shares their own experiences and thoughts about their covenanting pasts and their relationships with these covenants now. At every step, they seek to present and celebrate their best thinking and ideas about we humans as covenanters that don’t rely upon our having a static relationship with God and an “etched in stone at the time one covenanted” understanding of this important element of the spiritual life.
This is an encore presentation of an important and still very relevant two-part episode first released on 24 April 2017.
Covenanting is a huge feature of Mormon theology and group life. Beginning at age eight with baptism, and extending through the LDS temple endowment and sealing rites, Latter-day Saints are encouraged to make many covenants with God. Sunday services build into the sacrament ritual the chance to “renew” all the covenants one has made. For many Mormons, making and renewing these covenants are among the most sacred events of their lives, inspiring them to try to live up to the ideals for living and learning, and the promises, of each covenant. For other Latter-day Saints, especially those whose faith has shifted in the years following the moments they made covenants, the burden of having covenanted to do something that they are no longer as certain about, or perhaps even now reject, can be crushing. Some feel regret that the “Mormon track” has members make covenants at very young ages, prior to entering typical developmental stages when complexity enters one’s worldview: “If only I’d known what I know now, I would have chosen differently.” Others feel they were under-prepared for the specific covenants they made in the temple, and how when they reached that stage of the endowment they went ahead with making them partly because of family and loved ones who were present and expecting that of them. Mormonism teaches that when things are done through proper priesthood authority, “what is bound on earth is bound in heaven.” How, then, should someone whose journey is taking them into great complexity regarding Mormonism relate to such weighty covenants?
In this episode, Charles Randall Paul, Jennifer Finlayson-Fife, and Joseph Stanford, join Mormon Matters host Dan Wotherspoon for a wonderful and intense query into covenanting within Mormonism and whether or not the nature of covenants, or God, has an expectation of personal growth and change that would naturally affect our views and understandings of promises we have made previously. They also discuss what exactly are we “bound” to with regard to our covenants, and several other important aspects of this topic. The panel shares their own experiences and thoughts about their covenanting pasts and their relationships with these covenants now. At every step, they seek to present and celebrate their best thinking and ideas about we humans as covenanters that don’t rely upon our having a static relationship with God and an “etched in stone at the time one covenanted” understanding of this important element of the spiritual life.
This episode features two wonderful and creative thinkers and religious souls whose lives have been deeply influenced by Joseph Smith. But here is the kicker: neither are Latter-day Saints. Jane Barnes and Rob Lauer view Joseph through eyes we don't often (if ever) encounter within institutional Mormonism. Perhaps very few outside some who knew him personally were attracted by what most fascinates and enlivens them.
Jane was the primary writer and researcher for the 2007 PBS/Frontline and Helen Whitney produced documentary film, The Mormons. During her time working on the film, and even earlier, she came to appreciate Joseph as a dynamic, creative, prophetic figure, and she even had a "conversion" experience in which she understood him as a key figure in her awakening to her own spirituality. Ultimately, her experiences led her to write a much-celebrated memoir, Falling in Love with Joseph Smith: My Search for the Real Prophet (Tarcher/Penguin, 2012).
Rob encountered Joseph Smith in his teens, and connected deeply with him in a way that led him to join the church. As he encountered the disconnect between how he saw and encountered Joseph versus how the church and its culture had tamed him and bleached out of him most of the color and life that he had been attracted to, he left Mormonism. He re-joined for a while, even co-directing the Hill Cumorah pageant for seven years, before he felt Joseph's teachings led him out of the church again—but not because he didn't embrace them any longer but because they empowered him to see his being gay as an essential part of his deep spiritual identity, while also seeing that the church wasn't capable of sustaining him as a gay man. To this day, however, he still says his is a religion "of" Joseph Smith (meaning he believes his key and empowering insights about humans, gods, and life's highest call).
Interestingly, both Jane and Rob encountered Joseph Smith first through Fawn Brodie's book, No One Knows My History, which is generally thought by members as anti-Mormon. For them, however, they found a powerful figure on a unique journey, with gifts and creativity, that became a catalyst for their own spiritual walks.
Notice as you listen to this episode how taking a fresh look at Joseph from outside the "boxes" we in the church so often put him in and want to limit him to can allow us to see him in much more vibrant detail. As writers and artists (novelist/filmmaker and playwright/television producer/newspaper editor), they see Joseph as bold and imaginative as well as good and kind, but also as broken and full of contradictions, many of them that are very unappealing. Still, they see him as a "prophet" in the larger sense of the word rather than the limited view we in the church have cultivated as we have idealized the term, turned the title into a "president" of an institution, and shied away from representing him in all his humanness. It's this very humanness that leads them to love and appreciate him in ways that feel, at least to me, to be much more powerful than the level of encounter of most Latter-day Saints.
Dr. LaShawn Williams (EdD., LCSW, MPA) is on the faculty at Utah Valley University, where she teaches students studying social work. LaShawn was raised in the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints and faced many challenges associated with being a black child and then black woman in a predominantly white church community (in the United States) from the 1980s to the present day. In this episode she freely and forthrightly shares about these sorts of challenges as they played out in her life and that of her family. But most of all, the conversation involves how these challenges (and a wonderfully supportive parents) led to her developing a fierce sense of her own right to question things and use her voice to speak up for things that so many of us fail to even notice, let alone think about. She also shares how so much of this power and confidence emerged from a deep spiritual life and connection with God and Jesus Christ—one that was often severely tried but never severed.
As a result of this confidence, she and six other black women formed the Black LDS Legacy Committee, which earlier this year began to put on events that brought forward the history and firm roots of black people in Mormonism right from the beginning on through now. And it was through the Committee's determination to tell these stories that the Church itself embraced their ideas in such strength that they became one of the driving forces behind what became the "Be One" event that occurred in the Conference Center on June 1, 2018, acknowledging and celebrating the fortieth anniversary of the 1978 revelation that officially restored to black persons what LaShawn and many others already knew, that all are equal before God, and they should be recognized as such by access to the temple and its covenants and blessings, as well as priesthood power and leadership. It is terrific that in this episode we have a chance to hear pieces of that story—and about what she and the rest of the members of the committee are planning to do next.
In the final section of this two-part episode, LaShawn and Mormon Matters host Dan Wotherspoon discuss spiritual work, inner work, Godwrestling, and how and why we are all called by God/Life to re-examine everything and come to better grasp who we are as divine beings who, as is natural, allowed our veiled understanding of this deep truth become clouded by life's ups and downs and various messaging to the contrary that we let influence us and further bury this sense of our noble birthright. The focus, of course, is on ways we can and the importance of going into these difficult spaces, into our woundedness, into the roots of why we often refuse to believe that we are infinitely worthy. It's a terrific segment, as is this whole interview.
We know you'll enjoy listening!
Dr. LaShawn Williams (EdD., LCSW, MPA) is on the faculty at Utah Valley University, where she teaches students studying social work. LaShawn was raised in the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints and faced many challenges associated with being a black child and then black woman in a predominantly white church community (in the United States) from the 1980s to the present day. In this episode she freely and forthrightly shares about these sorts of challenges as they played out in her life and that of her family. But most of all, the conversation involves how these challenges (and a wonderfully supportive parents) led to her developing a fierce sense of her own right to question things and use her voice to speak up for things that so many of us fail to even notice, let alone think about. She also shares how so much of this power and confidence emerged from a deep spiritual life and connection with God and Jesus Christ—one that was often severely tried but never severed.
As a result of this confidence, she and six other black women formed the Black LDS Legacy Committee, which earlier this year began to put on events that brought forward the history and firm roots of black people in Mormonism right from the beginning on through now. And it was through the Committee's determination to tell these stories that the Church itself embraced their ideas in such strength that they became one of the driving forces behind what became the "Be One" event that occurred in the Conference Center on June 1, 2018, acknowledging and celebrating the fortieth anniversary of the 1978 revelation that officially restored to black persons what LaShawn and many others already knew, that all are equal before God, and they should be recognized as such by access to the temple and its covenants and blessings, as well as priesthood power and leadership. It is terrific that in this episode we have a chance to hear pieces of that story—and about what she and the rest of the members of the committee are planning to do next.
In the final section of this two-part episode, LaShawn and Mormon Matters host Dan Wotherspoon discuss spiritual work, inner work, Godwrestling, and how and why we are all called by God/Life to re-examine everything and come to better grasp who we are as divine beings who, as is natural, allowed our veiled understanding of this deep truth become clouded by life's ups and downs and various messaging to the contrary that we let influence us and further bury this sense of our noble birthright. The focus, of course, is on ways we can and the importance of going into these difficult spaces, into our woundedness, into the roots of why we often refuse to believe that we are infinitely worthy. It's a terrific segment, as is this whole interview.
Please listen!
The October 2018 General Conference has just concluded, but certainly not the discussion of it! Not for many, many months in our wards, stakes, and various gatherings of Mormons, and not here on Mormon Matters podcast (though we promise it won't be for "months and months")!
It was a fascinating conference with quite a few different dynamics at play, and so we gathered the next evening three wonderful and brilliant church and conference watcher—Jenne Alderks, Scott Turley, and Sara Lake—to share their immediate, raw, unprocessed but very powerful takes on what they noticed and how they experienced it. What followed was a remarkably energetic, passionate, moving—as well as fun (even a slight bit snarky at times conversation). Along with Mormon Matters host, Dan Wotherspoon, each shared from her or his compassionate and empathetic heart and soul, offering gratitude and praise where they felt it was deserved (and the cases were many), and sorrow, frustration, confusion, and genuine exasperation, sorrow, and hurt over some teachings or leader choices that called for it.
The discussion begins with reactions to, and wondering how the newly announced two-hour block of meetings will play out in the lives of Latter-day Saints. It then turns to key talks and features of the conference. Part 1 addresses a few talks, though some of the same ones continue to be discussed in the second part, but it primarily features an extended conversation about the General Women's Session and its messaging, both wonderful and hurtful, not to mention confusing in its mixed signaling. Part 2 features discussions of the panelists other highlights or lowlights, and is careful to be aware of those who are listening who might not have followed conference at all and are coming to this episode for their first exposure to what went on and how many our reacting to it. Dan closes this section by offering a few comments that remained on his list but were unspoken during the main recording session.
We believe that anyone who listens to this episode will be captivated by the fun the panelists had together even while they were raising deeply heartfelt issues and experiences. Please tune in! You are also invited to contribute to the conversations in the Comments section for this episode at MormonMatters.org. Thank you!
The October 2018 General Conference has just concluded, but certainly not the discussion of it! Not for many, many months in our wards, stakes, and various gatherings of Mormons, and not here on Mormon Matters podcast (though we promise it won't be for "months and months")!
It was a fascinating conference with quite a few different dynamics at play, and so we gathered the next evening three wonderful and brilliant church and conference watcher—Jenne Alderks, Scott Turley, and Sara Lake—to share their immediate, raw, unprocessed but very powerful takes on what they noticed and how they experienced it. What followed was a remarkably energetic, passionate, moving—as well as fun (even a slight bit snarky at times conversation). Along with Mormon Matters host, Dan Wotherspoon, each shared from her or his compassionate and empathetic heart and soul, offering gratitude and praise where they felt it was deserved (and the cases were many), and sorrow, frustration, confusion, and genuine exasperation, sorrow, and hurt over some teachings or leader choices that called for it.
The discussion begins with reactions to, and wondering how the newly announced two-hour block of meetings will play out in the lives of Latter-day Saints. It then turns to key talks and features of the conference. Part 1 addresses a few talks, though some of the same ones continue to be discussed in the second part, but it primarily features an extended conversation about the General Women's Session and its messaging, both wonderful and hurtful, not to mention confusing in its mixed signaling. Part 2 features discussions of the panelists other highlights or lowlights, and is careful to be aware of those who are listening who might not have followed conference at all and are coming to this episode for their first exposure to what went on and how many our reacting to it. Dan closes this section by offering a few comments that remained on his list but were unspoken during the main recording session.
We believe that anyone who listens to this episode will be captivated by the fun the panelists had together even while they were raising deeply heartfelt issues and experiences. Please tune in! You are also invited to contribute to the conversations in the Comments section for this episode at MormonMatters.org. Thank you!
We've all heard statements such as, "Obedience is the first law of heaven." We've also been charged to seek our own light and revelation on any teaching or directive presented before the whole church. What happens when the second injunction challenges the first? If we in good "conscience" (what many Latter-day Saints call the Light of Christ) cannot assent to what's put forward (and this can include in our local church settings, as well), how shall we approach this dilemma? It seems that wrestles with this particular pairing of injunctions—obedience and conscience—arise around general conference time, so this is a timely podcast.
For this discussion, Mormon Matters host Dan Wotherspoon is joined by the wonderful and thoughtful Jana Riess, Caleb Jones, and Eric Huntsman. Each of them share terrific ideas about how they frame and clarify in their own minds and hearts as the horns of this dilemma arise in their own lives. They dive into the origins of and wider issues surrounding "obedience," and much more! The conversation is absolutely terrific!
Please listen and then share your responses at the Mormon Matters podcast website!
We've all heard statements such as, "Obedience is the first law of heaven." We've also been charged to seek our own light and revelation on any teaching or directive presented before the whole church. What happens when the second challenges the first? If we in good "conscience" (what many Latter-day Saints call the Light of Christ) cannot assent to what's put forward (and this can include in our local church settings, as well), how shall we approach this dilemma? It seems that wrestles with this particular pairing of injunctions—obedience and conscience—arise around general conference time, so this is a timely podcast.
For this discussion, Mormon Matters host Dan Wotherspoon is joined by the wonderful and thoughtful Jana Riess, Caleb Jones, and Eric Huntsman. Each of them share terrific ideas about how they frame and clarify in their own minds and hearts as the horns of this dilemma arise in their own lives. They dive into the origins of and wider issues surrounding "obedience," and much more! The conversation is absolutely terrific!
Please listen and then share your responses at the Mormon Matters podcast website!
In just over a week after the release of this podcast episode, millions of Latter-day Saints from around the world will gather in person or other ways to hear messages from Mormonism's highest leadership councils. No one knows in advance what messages will be presented, what each male of female leader will have been inspired to prepare for the membership, but it has become a favorite pastime of many to speculate, and especially when leaders have given certain hints about possible changes in the near horizon. Such is the case here again.
In this episode, Mormon Matters host Dan Wotherspoon is joined by two other close conference watcher, Susan Hinckley and James Cottrell to discuss what we are hearing (and in that arena they focus primarily upon remarks given by Elder Jeffrey R. Holland three weeks ago in Draper, Utah, which contain several provocative statements), what we hope might happen, worry might happen, but most importantly how these three prepare themselves in advance to be able to receive whatever unfolds with an open and compassionate heart, and to be thoughtful and careful as they weigh the messages and policy or program changes that get announced.
The discussion is terrific. Please listen, enjoy, and allow yourselves to breath deeply and put yourself in as good a frame of mind as you can.
Please listen and enjoy!
In just over a week after the release of this podcast episode, millions of Latter-day Saints from around the world will gather in person or other ways to hear messages from Mormonism's highest leadership councils. No one knows in advance what messages will be presented, what each male of female leader will have been inspired to prepare for the membership, but it has become a favorite pastime of many to speculate, and especially when leaders have given certain hints about possible changes in the near horizon. Such is the case here again.
In this episode, Mormon Matters host Dan Wotherspoon is joined by two other close conference watchers, Susan Hinckley and James Cottrell to discuss what we are hearing (and in that arena they focus primarily upon remarks given by Elder Jeffrey R. Holland three weeks ago in Draper, Utah, which contain several provocative statements), what we hope might happen, worry might happen, but most importantly how these three prepare themselves in advance to be able to receive whatever unfolds with an open and compassionate heart, and to be thoughtful and careful as they weigh the messages and policy or program changes that get announced.
The discussion is terrific. Please listen, enjoy, and allow yourselves to breath deeply and put yourself in as good a frame of mind as you can.
Just two weeks ago, the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints released the first volume of its long-awaited history of the church series, Saints: The Standard of Truth. Written in the form of an engaging narrative, this book covers events in church history beginning in 1815 and concluding in 1846 as the Saints were forced out of Nauvoo and headed to Iowa to prepare to embark the next year on their westward migration.
The book includes like nothing before in official church history many stories about women—of their heroism, brilliant minds, and spiritual depth—who contributed mightily to the establishment and survival of the early church. It introduces many stories of immigrants and black Latter-day Saints, and their faith and successes in helping build and shape the Restoration. This new official church history volume is also especially notable for how it includes many details (often viewed as difficult and faith-dampening) about persons and events that are likely unknown to most Latter-day Saints. These include: an unprecedented-in-church-curricula amount of forthright attention to Joseph Smith's involvement in treasure seeking, an expanded First Vision depiction that is woven together and harmonized from Joseph's four first-hand accounts of what he experienced in the grove; a story of the translation of the Book of Mormon that includes his use of a seer stone and a hat in bringing it forth; the failures of the Kirtland Safety Society and Zion's Camp (referred to in the volume as the Camp of Israel); Joseph's own personal engagement in polygamous marriages; the Saints' own sometimes aggressive behavior that fueled escalations of violence against them; questionable decisions regarding calling certain individuals to high positions within the church, as well as choosing to destroy the press that printed the Nauvoo Expositor, which led quite directly to Joseph's and Hyrum's martyrdom.
We are thrilled and blessed to have the voices and perspectives of brilliant panelists in this two-part episode. They are the wonderful Megan Burnside, David E. MacKay, Brittney Hartley, and Cristina Rosetti. In Part 1 (Episode 508), they focus on the project itself and the approach to its history the church has chosen to take, their sense of the project's contributions along with areas in which it falls short, and their takes on what seem to be the church's primary goals in creating this series and how successful they think they will be met through an effort such as this. In Part 2 (Episode 509), they focus in on specific stories in the volumes and the choices that were made regarding what to leave in, what to leave out, why the church might have chosen to emphasize the reading of historical documents the way they did, over and against other options (some fairly well known but passed over here in favor of others). In every instance and comment, the tremendous intellects and good, good hearts of each panelist shine brightly.
Please listen and enjoy!
Just two weeks ago, the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints released the first volume of its long-awaited history of the church series, Saints: The Standard of Truth. Written in the form of an engaging narrative, this book covers events in church history beginning in 1815 and concluding in 1846 as the Saints were forced out of Nauvoo and headed to Iowa to prepare to embark the next year on their westward migration.
The book includes like nothing before in official church history many stories about women—of their heroism, brilliant minds, and spiritual depth—who contributed mightily to the establishment and survival of the early church. It introduces many stories of immigrants and black Latter-day Saints, and their faith and successes in helping build and shape the Restoration. This new official church history volume is also especially notable for how it includes many details (often viewed as difficult and faith-dampening) about persons and events that are likely unknown to most Latter-day Saints. These include: an unprecedented-in-church-curricula amount of forthright attention to Joseph Smith's involvement in treasure seeking, an expanded First Vision depiction that is woven together and harmonized from Joseph's four first-hand accounts of what he experienced in the grove; a story of the translation of the Book of Mormon that includes his use of a seer stone and a hat in bringing it forth; the failures of the Kirtland Safety Society and Zion's Camp (referred to in the volume as the Camp of Israel); Joseph's own personal engagement in polygamous marriages; the Saints' own sometimes aggressive behavior that fueled escalations of violence against them; questionable decisions regarding calling certain individuals to high positions within the church, as well as choosing to destroy the press that printed the Nauvoo Expositor, which led quite directly to Joseph's and Hyrum's martyrdom.
We are thrilled and blessed to have the voices and perspectives of brilliant panelists in this two-part episode. They are the wonderful Megan Burnside, David E. MacKay, Brittney Hartley, and Cristina Rosetti. In Part 1 (Episode 508), they focus on the project itself and the approach to its history the church has chosen to take, their sense of the project's contributions along with areas in which it falls short, and their takes on what seem to be the church's primary goals in creating this series and how successful they think they will be met through an effort such as this. In Part 2 (Episode 509), they focus in on specific stories in the volumes and the choices that were made regarding what to leave in, what to leave out, why the church might have chosen to emphasize the reading of historical documents the way they did, over and against other options (some fairly well known but passed over here in favor of others). In every instance and comment, the tremendous intellects and good, good hearts of each panelist shine brightly.
Please listen and enjoy!
At this moment, with the 2018 October General Conference just weeks away, many Latter-day Saints are—consciously and unconsciously—going through in their minds and hearts how they view and feel about teachings from the church's top leaders. What is their authoritative status? Are they to be considered on par with (or even superior and more authoritative than) the teachings found within the Standard Works? And what about our own personal revelation on particular subjects? How does that fit into the mix with scripture and statements and teachings from LDS general authorities? Do we leave aside our own sense of what God has led us to believe and simply shape our worldviews according to the leaders' teachings because they can't/won't lead us astray? Or do we wrestle and seek a way to honor all these sources of authority? This episode discusses these and other dilemmas related to what makes something "canonical" (in some way)—for the church as a whole, and/or for each of us personally.
In addition to the upcoming general conference, this conversation was prompted by a set of studies and essays that have been recently compiled together and published in a new volume: The Expanded Canon: Perspectives on Mormonism & Sacred Texts (Greg Kofford Books). In the episode, Mormon Matters host Dan Wotherspoon and the book's three editors, Blair Van Dyke, Brian D. Birch, and Boyd J. Peterson share about the above, and other book topics. They go into those mentioned above, as well as the authoritative status of women's writings, the nature of the shifts the church's views on electronic publishing have undergone (are we seeing online versions of the scriptures and other teachings shared via the web as equal in status of the same things in print?), and also the authoritative status of official "Proclamations" the church has issued in the past, and recently, with a particular focus on "The Family: A Proclamation to the World." To what degree are various Latter-day Saints incorporating this proclamation into their own "personal canon"?
Dan and the editors also briefly introduce other subjects taken on in the volume, such as the best way to approach reading scriptures, the place and role of the Golden Plates in LDS consciousness and conversation, how the Book of Mormon, Doctrine and Covenants, and Pearl of Great Price wound their way into canonical status, as well as the very character of each of the teachings within these books and what tasks or roles they perform in Mormon hearts and minds. They also overview a few particulars of most of the book's other topics, including how one non-Mormon scholar of religion approaches LDS truth claims, especially those contained in discussions surrounding the Golden Plates: their finding, taking possession of, translating, and being revealed to chosen witnesses, and proposes a third way that falls between full belief in all the events as reported and the conclusion many land on: that Joseph Smith is fraud and deliberate deceiver. And finally, what about patriarchal blessings? How do Mormons view them and their role in their personal lives? Where do these reverenced spiritual creations fit in the idea of the Mormon (or personal) "canon" ?
The episode grounds itself in the book and its coming together, but The Expanded Canon is used primarily as a springboard for getting into the profound issues and the wrestles they generate for both the institutional church and its members. We think you will really enjoy what transpires in this two-part episode, and that you will come away with many things worth chewing on in your own church- and self-examinations.
At this moment, with the 2018 October General Conference just weeks away, many Latter-day Saints are—consciously and unconsciously—going through in their minds and hearts how they view and feel about teachings from the church's top leaders. What is their authoritative status? Are they to be considered on par with (or even superior and more authoritative than) the teachings found within the Standard Works? And what about our own personal revelation on particular subjects? How does that fit into the mix with scripture and statements and teachings from LDS general authorities? Do we leave aside our own sense of what God has led us to believe and simply shape our worldviews according to the leaders' teachings because they can't/won't lead us astray? Or do we wrestle and seek a way to honor all these sources of authority? This episode discusses these and other dilemmas related to what makes something "canonical" (in some way)—for the church as a whole, and/or for each of us personally.
In addition to the upcoming general conference, this conversation was prompted by a set of studies and essays that have been recently compiled together and published in a new volume: The Expanded Canon: Perspectives on Mormonism & Sacred Texts (Greg Kofford Books). In the episode, Mormon Matters host Dan Wotherspoon and the book's three editors, Blair Van Dyke, Brian D. Birch, and Boyd J. Peterson share about the above, and other book topics. They go into those mentioned above, as well as the authoritative status of women's writings, the nature of the shifts the church's views on electronic publishing have undergone (are we seeing online versions of the scriptures and other teachings shared via the web as equal in status of the same things in print?), and also the authoritative status of official "Proclamations" the church has issued in the past, and recently, with a particular focus on "The Family: A Proclamation to the World." To what degree are various Latter-day Saints incorporating this proclamation into their own "personal canon"?
Dan and the editors also briefly introduce other subjects taken on in the volume, such as the best way to approach reading scriptures, the place and role of the Golden Plates in LDS consciousness and conversation, how the Book of Mormon, Doctrine and Covenants, and Pearl of Great Price wound their way into canonical status, as well as the very character of each of the teachings within these books and what tasks or roles they perform in Mormon hearts and minds. They also overview a few particulars of most of the book's other topics, including how one non-Mormon scholar of religion approaches LDS truth claims, especially those contained in discussions surrounding the Golden Plates: their finding, taking possession of, translating, and being revealed to chosen witnesses, and proposes a third way that falls between full belief in all the events as reported and the conclusion many land on: that Joseph Smith is fraud and deliberate deceiver. And finally, what about patriarchal blessings? How do Mormons view them and their role in their personal lives? Where do these reverenced spiritual creations fit in the idea of the Mormon (or personal) "canon" ?
The episode speaks of the book and tells of its coming together, but it is used primarily as a springboard for getting into these quite profound issues and the wrestles they generate for both the institutional church and its members. We think you will really enjoy what transpires in this two-part episode, and will come away with many things worth chewing on in your own church- and self-examinations.
No one who has appeared before on Mormon Matters has a more interesting, diverse, and ecumenical religious journey than Father Tom Roberts—one that also includes Mormonism from his very early years on through today. Father Tom has been on the show several times in the past, but in this episode we query in greater depth than previously about his faith walk, and we also zero in far more directly on his main study, writing, and teaching emphases: theosis/divinization and the enthronement passages within the Hebrew Bible and New Testament that are so often not not even noticed, let alone understood at all, by Christians and Latter-day Saints, as well as (what he has most recently released in a short book) divorce and remarriage from a Middle Eastern Biblical approach. It's a study that in some instances very clearly shows how so many in Christendom have completely missed the meaning of such difficult passages as "It hath been said, Whosoever shall put away his wife, let him give her a writing of divorcement: But I say unto you, That whosoever shall put away his wife, saving for the cause of fornication, causeth her to commit adultery: and whosoever shall marry her that is divorced committeth adultery" (Matthew 5:31–32). The clarifications Tom offers on these matters is much, much needed!
A big question framing the podcast is also how might a better understanding of the topics touched on herein mitigate some of the deep malaise many Latter-day Saints are feeling because of the primary ways that the correlated church has chosen to present the scriptures, as well as its own most profound teachings, in such a flat and quite lifeless way.
We believe you'll be intrigued by much that Father Tom shares in this interview, and we hope that some will feel drawn to contact Tom to possibly collaborate with him on projects and dialogues and in study settings. The rewards could be many.